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Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

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mark lawson
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount

Post by mark lawson » Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:52 am

Hi Steen I have one reserved for you, PM sent
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mark lawson
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by mark lawson » Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:50 pm

The last batch of MG34 AA Mounts (Fliegerbeschussgerät) have now sold out, I will be making more of these owing to the time it takes to assemble these mounts I expect the next batch wont be ready until September, if you would like to pre order one please send me a message.
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Vince Cutajar
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by Vince Cutajar » Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:13 pm

Thanks Mark

I guess I was lucky to get one before they got all sold.

Vince

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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by John-Heaps » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:26 pm

Hi Mark,
i will be getting a KT when the kits are ready, can i reserve a mount when you have some more ready, do you know who does a scale MG34 for it please.

Many thanks
John

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Kent Wiik
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by Kent Wiik » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:33 pm

Hi John,

Monkey depot has them:
https://www.monkeydepot.com/Rifle_Drago ... /d4838.htm

Kind regards
Kent
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mark lawson
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by mark lawson » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:55 pm

Hi John, I will have another batch of MG Mounts ((Fliegerbeschussgerät) very soon I will send you a message when they are available.

To expand on availability of the MG34T these come with the Dragon Bobby Woll and Johann Meiling figures.
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Mark Heaps
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by Mark Heaps » Sat Sep 07, 2019 4:12 pm

Standing by to be corrected by a small arms expert but I believe on late war tanks an MG42 on the AA mount would not be wrong.
My research has shown that the MG42 replaced the MG34 in infantry use, but production of the MG34 continued for tank use. Higher rate of fire on the MG42 caused the barrel to overheat quicker and the barrel on the MG34 could be swapped quicker and easier especially in a hull mount or coax mount in a tank or other fighting vehicle.
Whilst advantageous for the crews to have all the same, supply problems late on could have meant MG34 being prioritised for hull and turret fits, and the MG for the AA mount being what was available.
Late King Tigers did not have the ring mount for the AA MG but a pintle mount.
Mark

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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by mark lawson » Sat Sep 07, 2019 5:47 pm

MG42 was never officially used on the Fliegerbeschussgerät individual crews may have converted a mount for the MG42 but this was not common, Kent did post a picture a while back with the MG42 mounted.

All German armour only ever carried x2 MG34T one mounted in the hull the other coax, the use of an MG34T being used on the Fliegerbeschussgerät meant removing one of the guns from its official position hence why many pictures show no MG mounted on the Fliegerbeschussgerät.

MG42 never replaced the MG34 for infantry use the MG34 was still produced until the end of the war elite troops would have priority with the MG42, barrel change on the MG42 was much quicker and simplified over the MG34 even when mounted on AFV's or lafette.

In 1945 the cupola ring was not fitted to both Panther and Tiger II however there was still a mount fitted for AA use.
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by Mark Heaps » Sat Sep 07, 2019 6:17 pm

My research shows that production of the MG34 only continued because it was better than the MG42 for tank use. Production of MG34 was prioritised for the armoured vehicles. Infantry got the MG42. Yes, either of the MG34s could have been taken out of the hull or coax mount and put in the AA mount but that would not have been desirable.
I would suggest that crews had a third MG for the AA mount. preferably MG34 but if not available late war then a MG42.

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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by mark lawson » Sat Sep 07, 2019 6:59 pm

German military regulations stipulated x3 MG34T issued to each Panzer plus a Fliegerbeschussgerät, when one studies pictures from this period you will notice that mostly one of the x2 MG34T is mounted to the Fliegerbeschussgerät during road marches or rail transport when in any form of combat situation the MG34T is removed and returned to its official position, individual crews may have obtained an additional MG34 but this would net be the norm.

Permanent mounting of machine guns in the AA role was very common among allied tank crews especially American but this was not the case with German crews.
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Mark Heaps
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by Mark Heaps » Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:24 pm

My research is that the barrel change was not quicker and easier on the MG42 especially inside a tank and that is why production of the MG34 continued.
MG42 was not suitable for tank fits.
Although termed the AA mount, they were as much use as tits on a fish for shooting down attacking aircraft. They may give the crew a warm fuzzy feeling by being able to fire back but they were just wasting ammunition to no tangible effect.
However as a mount for a third MG to be used against attacking infantry, they could be put to great effect.

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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät)

Post by mark lawson » Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:28 pm

Mark,

Two of the reasons why the MG42 was not used in tanks during WWII is the higher rate of fire which would use a lot more ammunition meaning more storage more belt and barrel changes then it would require new mounts for the weapon the Germans realised that they either stayed with the slower firing MG34 or changed completely to MG42 making armorment of tanks difficult if they had x2 types of gun or very difficult if they re-tooled and changed all the mounts during war.

Your argument that it was not suitable for tank fits simply cannot be right as post war the Swiss mounted them in Centurions and the Germans mounted them in Leopard it stands to reason that they must have been able to change barrels, MG3 differs only in the re-chambered ammunition and rear sight plus a slightly different flash hider.

Changing the barrel on the MG34 requires rotating the receiver the MG42 was done via a charging handle on the side, the MG34 requires complicated rotating brackets to rotate the receiver, fitted on a Fliegerbeschussgerät the barrel change must have been very auckward
MG34
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QIrtSq8jPo
MG42
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msA5GNrVJ4s

The film for the MG34 is not the best as it doesn't explain the full procedure with a hot weapon, the MG42 had holes in the rear of the barrel a simple spent round could help remove the barrel the MG34 didn't have this feature.

all cupola mounted machine guns had little effect against aeroplanes and whilst a Fliegerbeschussgerät mounted MG could be used against ground troops it would mean the commander exposing himself to enemy fire the coax MG would be better suited to this as would the hull MG.

I'm sure if we ask any former tank commander their opinion would they rather to use a coax MG or stick their unarmoured head out of an armoured cupola to machine gun infantry I'm not convinced they would choose the latter.
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mark lawson
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Re: Panzer Cupola MG34 AA Mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät) back in stock

Post by mark lawson » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:24 pm

I have another batch of the cupola MG34 AA mount (Fliegerbeschussgerät) ready to ship.

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