Old Tiger, New Owner

Forum for discussion relating to the King Tiger
Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Sat Dec 17, 2016 7:33 pm

Hi all,

My name is Patrik and a week ago I picked up a 99% unbuilt KT. This is the base kit only so I will have to come up with something if it is to be driveable. I would like to put a combustion engine in it with a gearbox mimicking the function of the original but as this acquisition came kind of suddenly I do not have much of a plan to speak of yet.

Right now I am busy test fitting and mesmerizing over the massivenes of everything.
182b.jpg
That built 1% is quite interesting though, involving 3D printed parts and rebored wheel hubs. I too have a 3D printer and have used it to fabricate temporary replacements for the taper locks that have gone missing. Next, I have been eyeing the periscope inserts...
TaperLock.jpg
This will be off to a slow start as I do not have a proper build area right now. Also, lacking the aforementioned plan I am wary of getting into the no-return build stages. But, it's a start!


Best Regards,
Patrik Johansson
Last edited by Patrik Johansson on Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Phil Woollard
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Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Phil Woollard » Sat Dec 17, 2016 8:18 pm

Well Patric you sound bonkers enough so you will fit right in, just keep us posted on the build that will keep you focused and be interesting for us/me, if you can make that KT move under gas power that would be fantastic, if you go down the stock route it will be easyer, but easy is not what we do :x ..regards Phil
Mechanical engineer, Pyrotechnic technician, and small time farmer.
Youtube channel, Magpiespyro. For 1/6th scale video action!
Email; philandkris2@hotmail.com

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Sun Dec 18, 2016 7:37 pm

Thanks Phil. I'll do my best to keep clear of the easy ways. :wink:

Not happy with stock tolerances, previous owner had the wheel hubs drilled out, a aluminium insert pressed into place and drilled to bearing accepting dimensions.
Hub.jpg
And isn't this 3D printed muzzle with metal details just the sweetest thing?
Muzzle.jpg
It's like it would be a shame if some one were to paint it...


So far I two concerns:

-The specs on the output gears of the motion pack? Module, number of teeth, that sort of thing.

-Should the suspension arms be touching? Is it supposed to be that way and function as a (harsh) bump stop.

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Tue Dec 20, 2016 6:46 pm

I had to assemble one of the tracks for no other reason.
Links.jpg
Has a suitable replacement for the split pins evolved? Sure I haven't rimmed them yet but they catch on everything and deform. Solder? Other type of pin?

I like how the manual elaborates across two pages about the orientation of the road wheels, only for it to be ultimatly decided by the hub plates. Or am I missing something?

Torsion bars are a really tight fit.

Christoffer Ahlfors
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Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Christoffer Ahlfors » Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:27 pm

Don't worry about the cotter pins. Just fold them around backwards and cut off the excess and you will be just fine. By all means do not solder! You will need to take the tracks off occasionally and with cotter pins, this is a reasonably easy task. There are people who have machined prototypical rings with fasteners. Chances are that you will have to remove a track in the field and that you will lose such minute details in the grass. Grabbing a new washer and cotter pin out of the bag will not bring out tears if this happens. Just be sure to have that and a couple of track links in your field repair kit.

Cheers,
/Chris
Klotzen, nicht kleckern (Guderian on panzer tactics, but the way I interpret it - it applies to a great many things in life)

Patrik Johansson
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Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:32 pm

I won't worry more about it then. Thanks.

Is it bad form to use the links on the side of the turret for spares? :wink:

Per Sonnervik
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Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Per Sonnervik » Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:35 am

Hello Patrik,

First of all good to hear that Stefan´s Tiger II remained in Sweden. I also find your idea of having an combustion engine and working gearbox in the model interesting but be warned as that can be quite expensive with all the gears (unless you cut them yourself).

As for the cotter pins I´d remove them all, save say four in stratigic places as you may need to remove the tracks in the field. Use spring pins on the rest - nothing to get snagged by the tracks.

Per

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:11 pm

Hello Per,

Yes, let's say I'm doing a community service :wink:

It's just a wish list so far but a doable one I hope. On the plus side, if I get a single input transmission working, I can have interchangeable units of gas or electric motors. If I get to dream a little.

Christoffer Ahlfors
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Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Christoffer Ahlfors » Thu Dec 22, 2016 9:14 pm

Oh, haven't you heard? We are moving away from internal combustion engines and to electric motors and batteries these days! :lol:

Cheers,
/Chris
Klotzen, nicht kleckern (Guderian on panzer tactics, but the way I interpret it - it applies to a great many things in life)

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Thu Dec 22, 2016 9:46 pm

But, but... that is sooo 1880's...


Image

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Thu Dec 22, 2016 10:25 pm

When not being quippy (sorry :oops: ) on the interwebs I oversee the CAD, CAM and CAE systems of about 250 users. As I don't get to play with those toys myself I have to make do somehow else. I made this tool to hold the suspension arms at 35 degrees, maybe that will facilitate grinding the flats for the grub screws.
ArmHolder.jpg

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:40 pm

The torsion bars are a really tight fit in the suspension shafts. There is 0.1 mm missing. Fit to the two suspension bars is fine. Made a clamp to hold a piece of emery cloth as I turn the bar with the screw driver. Yet to see if good idea...
slipfixtur1.jpg
slipfixtur2.jpg
slipfixtur3.jpg
slipfixtur4.jpg

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:38 pm

If the drive gear is not module 1.5 and pressure angle 20 degrees, some one please speak up now. It seems to be a fit though.
lillehjul.jpg
I plan to make a 3D printed prototype drive system, I am betting it will be sturdy enough to prove functionality on the bench and maybe even on smooth surfaces but I didn't say that. :wink:

A number of books came with the model, VK45.02 to Tiger II by Jentz & Doyle being one of them, but none goes into the kind of details I am looking for. I understand the L 801 transmission is based on the double differential principle with a two speed steering input but any other information than that and min and max steering radius is difficult to find. Is stuff like individual gear ratios documented somewhere?

ATTILA KISS
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Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by ATTILA KISS » Mon Jan 02, 2017 9:03 pm

Hi, Patrick
One friend of mine had a stug driven by a commercial IC motor with a gearbox and clutch, it worked OK but the sound was a little bit odd. There are some plans for such a drive , i can look it up if you interested..
Cheers
Attila

Patrik Johansson
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:00 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: Old Tiger, New Owner

Post by Patrik Johansson » Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:58 pm

Hi Attila,
I have a pretty good idea of how and what I want to do, these ideas go back to when I started out with 1/16 scale almost 20 years ago so I have had time to think about it (only none of that ever got finished...) But please, do share.

You bring up sound which I agree is important. I have been looking at some of Saito's engines, their 3 cylinder radials specifically but they have boxers too, for something that does not sound like a weed wacker. I have been wanting one with as big displacement as possible to keep rpm down and their 60cc version is rated at 4.6 hp which I don't expect to be needing anywhere near. Just listen to it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uB-W7S7kwCo

(And there is even a 90cc but I have not found enough information on it so not sure it will fit)

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