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Panther

suspension question

Forum for discussion relating to the Panther

suspension question

Postby willie leonard » Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:10 am

Having a heck of a time trying to figure out the double torsion set up.When I
fully tighten the shafts in the arms the holes are way off from were it seems they should be.Even with the shims they don't seem to come close.If anybodys got a picture of the proper set-up or any tips on how to tighten the shafts without putting gouge marks on them it would be greatly appreciated. Image
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Re: suspension question

Postby Paul Morris » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:48 am

Hi Willie.

I will try to help out here done three of these hulls now, I think I know what you are asking is it the location of the holes in the suspension shafts thats causing the problem for you? i.e. how to tighten the torsion bars when you have pushed the assembled arm through the side of the tank?

If so this is how I do it.
I think the instuctions can be a little bit mis leading at first glance, assemble the arms and shafts by holding the shaft on the shoulder with a set of mole grips this will slightly mark the shaft but it makes no difference as this part does not go through the suspension bar. once this is done I personally cross drill and roll pin straight through the arm and threaded portion of the shaft . . . they can and do unscrew themselves in time.
Then remove about 1.5 mm from the base of your grub screws I do this with an old screwdriver type allen key and a power file, if you don't have the file you could try a bench grinder but watch they don't fly back at you!!
flattening the base of the grub screw allows you to fit and lock down your torsion bar as the grub screws are now short enough to be below the surface of the shaft and the whole assembly can be passed through the suspension bar and tightened down at the other side of the tank.
I hope this helps you out? if not I am at the other end of the e mail and always happy to help.
Kind regards Paul :wink:
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Re: suspension question

Postby Steve Norris » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:06 pm

Hi Willie.
On my suspension set up i did away with the grub screws and used M4-6 cap heads this allows a much greater tightening torque to be applied, the only down side is that you have to fit the grub screws after the shaft and torsion bar are installed in the hull (No great problem). I initially fitted 3 shims to the shafts but have since reduced it to 2 as the ride height seemed a little high, i will only know if that was the correct decission when the tank is complete.
Fitting roll pins is a good way of permemently fixing the shafts to the arms as Paul sugested, The only down side being that you cannot then adjust the shims if the ride height is incorrect.
This is a shot of my installed torsion bars with grub screws, hope it helps.

Image

Regards

Steve
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Re: suspension question

Postby willie leonard » Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:46 am

Image Thanks Steve and Paul for your prompt response. Very much enjoying following both you guys on the forum,and can't wait to see your finnished products,especially the Jadgtiger.Acording to the Offiicial Armortek Advice Section of the forum, the optimal setting for the suspension arms is between 40 and 60 degrees.When I fully tightened the first four shafts to the arms the grub holes were at between 7 and 9 o'clock when it seems they should be at about 11 o'clock. It took about 5 to 7 shims each to get them about right. At this rate im going to be running out of shims within the first six suspension arms. I was just wondering if anyone else ran into this problem.
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Re: suspension question

Postby Steve Norris » Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:06 am

Willie,
5 to 7 shims is way to much, either you have got a problem with the parts manufacture (which i doubt) or you are setting the suspension to the wrong angle. Rather than talk about angles which can be confusing try setting your suspension so that the axle center line is about 10mm below the hull bottom plate, this should take 2 shims and be about the correct position.
Regards
Steve
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Re: suspension question

Postby leesellars » Thu Sep 29, 2011 6:21 pm

Hello Willie

On my bergpanther I did away with the shims alltogether. The original Panther didnt have shims so thats good enough for me. When you set the system up you will notice that all the flats end up in the same possition. So i set up at 40 and redrilled the M4 holes for the torsion bar shafts on a jig i made on my milling machine. I also cross drilled the torsion bar shafts as normal. I put the shims in a linn bin and put it on a shelf.

lee
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Re: suspension question

Postby Armortek » Fri Sep 30, 2011 10:48 am

Hi Willie

I dont quite understand the problem here. The picture you show in your first post looks correct. The advice from Steve is good, but I would strongly advise against going down the same route as Lee. Check your assembly and let me know how you get on directly by e-mail to avoid confusing multiple opinions here on the forum.

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Re: suspension question

Postby willie leonard » Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:52 am

Hi Mark,
The first picture I posted seems to be the right angle, however it took five shims to get it at that angle.I was going by the
Offical Technical Advice by Armortek posting that said the optimal setting for the suspension is between 40 and 60 degrees.
These are set at 45 to 50 degrees. The first one I used one shim,the other two about five shims each.While I haven't put them all together yet I have hand tightened several others and on some it looks like a shim or two will do the trick, on
others it could be a half dozen. Bottom line i've got 15 shims left and 13 suspension arms to go.
Best Regards
Willie
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Re: suspension question

Postby Armortek » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:33 am

Hi Willie

We can send you plenty more shims if you need them. Just let us know.

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Re: suspension question

Postby nick pannell » Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:41 am

Hi All',
I have just got my model with the panther universal hull and have read the instructions 4 ~5 times and it said that the long flat on tortion bar B should be in the horizontal position but I can't seem to be able to make it so ,Any idears to help me out
nick P. :o
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Re: suspension question

Postby Armortek » Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:37 pm

Hi Nick

Attach a picture of your assembly so that we can see what you have. We can advise which to go from that.

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Re: suspension question

Postby Bill Riedel » Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:45 pm

I am finally back in the US and am just begining my Panther build. These comments on the suspension issues are quite important and interesting. I have a simple/stupid question as I am not even that far. While laying out the inspection plates on the belly I have noticed that the holes for the battery tray are not even; that is, on one end the two holes are closer to the end of the plate than the other. Which is to the front, short side or long?
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